A president for Europe?

matt.berlin · Post by **matt.berlin** » Mon Apr 22, 2002 11:07 pm

I like the idea of a European prime minister, with an elected government being given all the powers currently held by the commission and council of ministers. A president would be good, as well ... but i think he or she should have a symbolic role, like the president in germany.

Olivier · Post by **Olivier** » Wed May 01, 2002 11:12 am

matt.berlin wrote: I like the idea of a European prime minister, with an elected government being given all the powers currently held by the commission and council of ministers. A president would be good, as well ... but i think he or she should have a symbolic role, like the president in germany.

Why would we have a prime minister?

After all, there is no prime minister in the USA, and it works well...

As you live in the United Kingdom... Do you think Europe could get a monarch?

Olivier

matt.berlin · Post by **matt.berlin** » Wed May 01, 2002 7:11 pm

Olivier wrote:Why would we have a prime minister? After all, there is no prime minister in the USA, and it works well...

I would have to disagree with that!

Olivier wrote:Do you think Europe could get a monarch?

I severely doubt it ... fortunately. Hopefully, we'll get rid of ours soon as well (by the way, I think that saying that publically is actually a crime in the UK ... but I think it is challengeable under the Human Rights Act).

Olivier · Post by **Olivier** » Wed May 01, 2002 10:28 pm

matt.berlin wrote:
Olivier wrote:Why would we have a prime minister? After all, there is no prime minister in the USA, and it works well...
I would have to disagree with that!

Have you heard about the Convention on the Future of Europe? Are there already some informations about what we'll get soon?

matt.berlin wrote:
Olivier wrote:Do you think Europe could get a monarch?
I severely doubt it ... fortunately. Hopefully, we'll get rid of ours soon as well (by the way, I think that saying that publically is actually a crime in the UK ... but I think it is challengeable under the Human Rights Act).

You are free to express yourself, in the United Kingdom! There are several MP's who have asked for the end of the Monarchy... but it seams that the british people disagree with them.

My "proposal" was a joke. As a republican, I wouldn't like the EU to have a king or a queen!
By the way, I wonder what will happen to the 7 monarchs when Europe will be a (con)federation...

Olivier

matt.berlin · Post by **matt.berlin** » Wed May 01, 2002 11:25 pm

I haven't heard anything from the Convention ... maybe they are planning a big surprise!

Actually, under the 1848 Treason Felony Act it is illegal to call for the monarchy to be overthrown, although it has not been enforced in recent years. Also, MPs are certainly not allowed to debate the abolition of the monarchy in parliament.

Unfortunately, I can't see the monarchies going ... their roles are now simply ceremonial, and so it will be easy for them to continue staying in the public eye ... even if their "powers" were taken away.

matt.berlin · Post by **matt.berlin** » Wed May 01, 2002 11:38 pm

Actually, to clarify further ... under the Treason Act of 1351 it is illegal to IMAGINE the death of the monarch ...

Or, as it was worded in the 1848 legislation If any person whatsoever shall, within the UnitedKingdom or without, compass, imagine, invent, devise or intend to deprive or depose our most gracious lady the Queen.....from the style, honour, or royal name of the imperial crown of the United Kingdom ...

Therefore, if you are sitting there in Paris imagining the abolition of the British monarchy, you are technically committing a criminal offence under UK law

Olivier · Post by **Olivier** » Thu May 02, 2002 1:39 am

matt.berlin wrote: I haven't heard anything from the Convention ... maybe they are planning a big surprise!

Actually, under the 1848 Treason Felony Act it is illegal to call for the monarchy to be overthrown, although it has not been enforced in recent years. Also, MPs are certainly not allowed to debate the abolition of the monarchy in parliament.

Unfortunately, I can't see the monarchies going ... their roles are now simply ceremonial, and so it will be easy for them to continue staying in the public eye ... even if their "powers" were taken away.

I didn't know all this! What happened in 1848? The revolutionnary movement also occured in the UK? In France, King Louis-Philippe abdicated after a revolution. A president has been elected then. His name was... Louis-Napoléon Bonaparte (who became emperor Napoleon III in 1852).

I think the British want to keep these ceremonials. The death of Queen Mother Elizabeth proved it, didn't it?

Olivier · Post by **Olivier** » Thu May 02, 2002 1:39 am

matt.berlin wrote: Therefore, if you are sitting there in Paris imagining the abolition of the British monarchy, you are technically committing a criminal offence under UK law

Well I DO !!!

matt.berlin · Post by **matt.berlin** » Thu May 02, 2002 7:24 pm

I'll alert Europol, shall I?

Ernst · Post by **Ernst** » Mon Jun 03, 2002 2:54 am

smh wrote:I think it would be hard to elect one, the smaller countries would never have a chance.

I have to disagree with that! Probably they would have the best chances! After all who would vote for a German candidate(except the Germans)? And I cannot imagine that very many would favor a french candidate either! The little countries are not suspicious of domination so they would probably have the biggest chances at least at the beginning!

Olivier · Post by **Olivier** » Mon Jun 03, 2002 3:57 pm

matt.berlin wrote:I'll alert Europol, shall I?

Try to find where I am!

Olivier · Post by **Olivier** » Mon Jun 03, 2002 3:59 pm

Ernst wrote:
smh wrote:I think it would be hard to elect one, the smaller countries would never have a chance.
I have to disagree with that! Probably they would have the best chances! After all who would vote for a German candidate(except the Germans)? And I cannot imagine that very many would favor a french candidate either! The little countries are not suspicious of domination so they would probably have the biggest chances at least at the beginning!

And for the moment, the leader of the European Parlement is irish, the leader of the Commission is italian, the leader of the Court of Luxembourg is spanish... No country has a domination.

O.

wouter · Post by **wouter** » Wed Jun 05, 2002 12:59 pm

there are some disadvantges in the current system, because the all the tasks have to be shared equally between the countries it isn't always the best person or country that gets the task p.a. the president of the european bank Wim Duisenberg has to retire at half the time of his mandate because france wants to have the preisident by that time.
I think an elected president for europ will not work a believe more in a chairman elected by the european parliament

Olivier · Post by **Olivier** » Tue Jun 11, 2002 3:35 pm

wouter wrote: I think an elected president for europ will not work a believe more in a chairman elected by the european parliament

What would ypu prefer?

The president of the Convention (Giscard) has proposed the end of the 6 months precidency system. He asks for an elected president by the european parlement. The heads of state prefer to choose him by themselves.

For Giscard , the european president should have been president or prime minister of one state.

Olivier

wouter · Post by **wouter** » Wed Jun 12, 2002 11:22 am

Olivier wrote:The president of the Convention (Giscard) has proposed the end of the 6 months precidency system. He asks for an elected president by the european parlement. The heads of state prefer to choose him by themselves.

For Giscard , the european president should have been president or prime minister of one state.

Olivier

I don't think we should call it a president because i don't think that is what europe wants or needs maybe in the future. but i t\hink it would be hard for an frenchman to accept an german president (or maybe even an english one

)

and Giscards proposal that it should be a former president or prime minisister is just to make sure that there will be a job for him and his former colleagues

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