EuroBillTracker

trinacria wrote:attention tomorrow morning the Austrian brothers will surely hit the usual 5.if not make them .... be a bad day

Who do you attribute "Austrian brothers" to? And what's your point with "will surely hit the usual 5"?
Rgds, Franz

presidente wrote:Pinco was a fake? ok, right delete notes...but we must stop also users that deliberately exchange notes with other users..an example?

2009-02-19 21:13:51 Jyväskylä - Vihtavuori JiiPee72 - Tinker's damn 15 2

or triple hit like this: http://it.eurobilltracker.eu/notes/?id=58660626

this guys are arrived at 641 hits each other!!!

Well me and hinti have 925 hits toghether(among a lot of moderated ones) and WE DONT CHANGE NOTES,it just happens

Look suspicious to me: Provex


2009-02-20 09:32:47 5 EURLxxxx1027xxx Exxxxx Uimaharju ( Flag for Finska Finska, 81280)
2009-02-20 09:32:47 5 EURLxxxx1027xxx Exxxxx Uimaharju ( Flag for Finska Finska, 81280)
2009-02-20 09:32:47 5 EURLxxxx1027xxx (*) Exxxxx Uimaharju ( Flag for Finska Finska, 81280)
2009-02-20 09:32:47 5 EURLxxxx1027xxx Exxxxx Uimaharju ( Flag for Finska Finska, 81280)
2009-02-20 09:32:47 5 EURLxxxx1027xxx Exxxxx Uimaharju ( Flag for Finska Finska, 81280)
2009-02-20 09:32:47 5 EURLxxxx1027xxx Exxxxx Uimaharju ( Flag for Finska Finska, 81280)

And more and more... Again Provex.
I'd start to see the note entering pattern of Provex. Every possible 'real' note generates a ten notes fake series.
Let's start to wait action of the cleaning team

2009-02-20 10:30:06 10E Txxxx6577xxx Kxxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70110)
2009-02-20 10:30:06 10E Txxxx6577xxx Kxxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70110)
2009-02-20 10:30:06 10E Txxxx6577xxx Kxxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70110)
2009-02-20 10:30:06 10E Txxxx6577xxx Kxxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70110)
2009-02-20 10:30:06 10E Txxxx6577xxx Kxxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70110)
2009-02-20 10:30:06 10E Txxxx6577xxx Kxxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70110)
2009-02-20 10:30:06 10E Txxxx6577xxx Kxxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70110)
2009-02-20 10:30:06 10E Txxxx6577xxx Kxxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70110)
2009-02-20 10:30:06 10E Txxxx6577xxx Kxxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70110)
2009-02-20 10:30:06 10E Txxxx6577xxx Kxxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70110)
2009-02-20 10:32:47 5E Lxxxx1027xxx Exxxxx Uimaharju ( Suomi, 81280)
2009-02-20 10:32:47 5E Lxxxx1027xxx Exxxxx Uimaharju ( Suomi, 81280)
2009-02-20 10:32:47 5E Lxxxx1027xxx Exxxxx Uimaharju ( Suomi, 81280)
2009-02-20 10:32:47 5E Lxxxx1027xxx Exxxxx Uimaharju ( Suomi, 81280)
2009-02-20 10:32:47 5E Lxxxx1027xxx Exxxxx Uimaharju ( Suomi, 81280)
2009-02-20 10:32:47 5E Lxxxx1027xxx Exxxxx Uimaharju ( Suomi, 81280)
2009-02-20 10:32:47 5E Lxxxx1027xxx (*) Exxxxx Uimaharju ( Suomi, 81280)
2009-02-20 10:32:47 5E Lxxxx1027xxx Exxxxx Uimaharju ( Suomi, 81280)
2009-02-20 10:32:47 5E Lxxxx1027xxx Exxxxx Uimaharju ( Suomi, 81280)
2009-02-20 10:32:47 5E Lxxxx1027xxx Exxxxx Uimaharju ( Suomi, 81280)
2009-02-20 10:35:06 10E Xxxxx8154xxx Pxxxxx Uimaharju ( Suomi, 81280)
2009-02-20 10:35:06 10E Xxxxx8154xxx Pxxxxx Uimaharju ( Suomi, 81280)
2009-02-20 10:35:06 10E Xxxxx8154xxx Pxxxxx Uimaharju ( Suomi, 81280)
2009-02-20 10:35:06 10E Xxxxx8154xxx Pxxxxx Uimaharju ( Suomi, 81280)
2009-02-20 10:35:06 10E Xxxxx8154xxx Pxxxxx Uimaharju ( Suomi, 81280)
2009-02-20 10:35:06 10E Xxxxx8154xxx Pxxxxx Uimaharju ( Suomi, 81280)
2009-02-20 10:35:06 10E Xxxxx8154xxx Pxxxxx Uimaharju ( Suomi, 81280)
2009-02-20 10:35:06 10E Xxxxx8154xxx Pxxxxx Uimaharju ( Suomi, 81280)
2009-02-20 10:35:06 10E Xxxxx8154xxx Pxxxxx Uimaharju ( Suomi, 81280)
2009-02-20 10:35:06 10E Xxxxx8154xxx Pxxxxx Uimaharju ( Suomi, 81280)
2009-02-20 10:39:43 5E Vxxxx1772xxx Mxxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:39:43 5E Vxxxx1772xxx Mxxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:39:43 5E Vxxxx1772xxx Mxxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:39:43 5E Vxxxx1772xxx Mxxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:39:43 5E Vxxxx1772xxx Mxxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:39:43 5E Vxxxx1772xxx Mxxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:39:43 5E Vxxxx1772xxx Mxxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:39:43 5E Vxxxx1772xxx Mxxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:39:43 5E Vxxxx1772xxx Mxxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:39:43 5E Vxxxx1772xxx Mxxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:41:37 5E Lxxxx4343xxx Exxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:41:37 5E Lxxxx4343xxx Exxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:41:37 5E Lxxxx4343xxx Exxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:41:37 5E Lxxxx4343xxx Exxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:41:37 5E Lxxxx4343xxx Exxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:41:37 5E Lxxxx4343xxx Exxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:41:37 5E Lxxxx4343xxx Exxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:41:37 5E Lxxxx4343xxx Exxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:41:37 5E Lxxxx4343xxx Exxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:41:37 5E Lxxxx4343xxx Exxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:43:49 5E Lxxxx5596xxx Exxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:43:49 5E Lxxxx5596xxx Exxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:43:49 5E Lxxxx5596xxx Exxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:43:49 5E Lxxxx5596xxx Exxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:43:49 5E Lxxxx5596xxx Exxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:43:49 5E Lxxxx5596xxx Exxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:43:49 5E Lxxxx5596xxx Exxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:43:48 5E Lxxxx5596xxx Exxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:43:48 5E Lxxxx5596xxx Exxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:43:48 5E Lxxxx5596xxx Exxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:45:55 5E Lxxxx6910xxx Exxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:45:55 5E Lxxxx6910xxx Exxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:45:55 5E Lxxxx6910xxx Exxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:45:55 5E Lxxxx6910xxx Exxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:45:55 5E Lxxxx6910xxx Exxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:45:55 5E Lxxxx6910xxx Exxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:45:55 5E Lxxxx6910xxx Exxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:45:55 5E Lxxxx6910xxx Exxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:45:55 5E Lxxxx6910xxx Exxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)
2009-02-20 10:45:55 5E Lxxxx6910xxx Exxxxx Kuopio ( Suomi, 70100)

Below is the hit list of user Steenbergen http://nl.eurobilltracker.eu/profile/?c ... ser=104741. What a coincidence! Little doubt that users Steenbergen and Cees08 know each other

2008-01-19 11:12:55 5 EUR Naarden - Ede Steenbergen - Packbell 41 285
2007-08-08 10:35:21 10 EUR Naarden - Wijk bij Duurstede Steenbergen - Cees08 36 5
2007-07-09 09:46:03 20 EUR Naarden - Wijk bij Duurstede Steenbergen - Cees08 35 39
2007-06-27 09:03:17 5 EUR Naarden - Wijk bij Duurstede Steenbergen - Cees08 35 79

CarlosManta wrote: In due time italian users will eventually realize also how good it is to breath in and get only fresh and clean air, and will also be thankful.

I'm afraid you missed the point.
The almost general opinion in italian forum is not that all Pinco's note were good but that, for sure, some of the deleted ones were.

So nobody here is angry because Pincopallino has been hit by the cleaning group, but a lot of people agree to consider the applied method unusually radical.

We all are afraid that a big amount of good notes have been removed together with the maybe enormous amount of fake ones and we are surprised that a similar behaviour seemed to be different from what we were used to see for previous analyzed users.

I think this is the most diffused opinion in italian community. If any italian user does not agree it will be useful to read here his personal point of view.

Please investigate this hit: http://nl.eurobilltracker.com/notes/?id=59022077 between Cees08 and CSTNBRGN.
They have a lot of hits together, all with the same comments. Also both usernames are quite similar in Dutch if you ask me. They also have hits with Steenbergen B, which looks also similar. I think this user is having three accounts.

-flop- wrote:The almost general opinion in italian forum is not that all Pinco's note were good but that, for sure, some of the deleted ones were.

As de-jo wroted before Pincos faked more of 99% percent of his notes! Since the point when he started with the behavior of inventing serials was very clear to determine, he looses all notes from this date on as it happens with all other fakers!

-flop- wrote:We all are afraid that a big amount of good notes have been removed together with the maybe enormous amount of fake ones and we are surprised that a similar behaviour seemed to be different from what we were used to see for previous analyzed users.

I didn't see any difference to other users. Since deleting notes is a very servere approach, as long there is any doubt, the cleaning girls will not delete any notes! But in this case of pinco the proofs were really overwhelming. Please understand, that you will get no explaination in detail here, how pinco faked, but some trustworth users were involved in the discussion about the founded results!

The only accusation someone can made, is that pinco could do this for nearly 5 years. But is this the fault of the "Cleaning girls"?

I, too, was just about to point out the suspicous hits between users Cees08, Steenbergen and CSTNBRGN (which I interpret as Cees STeeNBeRGeN).

If you are checking for fake notes, could you check this account: http://nl.eurobilltracker.com/profile/?user=102240

Because i know his brother, who told me that wesmacq is a faker...

ErGo wrote:I didn't see any difference to other users. Since deleting notes is a very servere approach, as long there is any doubt, the cleaning girls will not delete any notes! But in this case of pinco the proofs were really overwhelming. Please understand, that you will get no explaination in detail here, how pinco faked, but some trustworth users were involved in the discussion about the founded results!

Just some considerations:

1) As far as I know, there are some italian users with a scanned image coming from Pinco of the their mutual hit-note. These notes have been removed too.

2) If Pinco had more than 99% of fake notes this means that he is comparable to a genuine user from Rome having tracked about 7000 notes (the remaining 760000 are faked so likely they are not in Rome). I hardly believe that such a user could have dozens of hits with other users from Rome as Pinco had.

3) I repeat once more to be sure of full understanding. I have no doubts about the overwhelming proofs of Pinco's faking and like me, I am sure, many other italian users.
I have some doubts about numbers. More than 99% looks strange to me.
What I would like to see are the proofs of this percentage.

Moise wrote:

presidente wrote:Pinco was a fake? ok, right delete notes...but we must stop also users that deliberately exchange notes with other users..an example?

2009-02-19 21:13:51 Jyväskylä - Vihtavuori JiiPee72 - Tinker's damn 15 2

or triple hit like this: http://it.eurobilltracker.eu/notes/?id=58660626

this guys are arrived at 641 hits each other!!!

Well me and hinti have 925 hits toghether(among a lot of moderated ones) and WE DONT CHANGE NOTES,it just happens

may be you forget that they know each other, they go always in vacation together they don't have scruple to make this type of hits in every location they go (last summer they were in Sicilia and in Malta e they made several hits fortunately already moderated). So I think that in case like this needs a rule of automatic moderation for hit with less than 20 days. Are not friendly? ok but sure are not interesting!!!

-flop- wrote:What I would like to see are the proofs of this percentage.

As I am not one of the cleaning girls, I cannot give you exact numbers (and I'm not sure the cleaning girls can), but what evidence I have seen amounts to significantly more than 99% of his notes. The maybe one note in a few hundred that may have been real will of course also have been deleted, because Pinco used it as a basis for his faking. And who could now say which notes those were - surely not even Pinco himself... With the exception of those scans - that's a matter for consideration, if the scans still exist.

Congratulation Fu Pincopallino Clan with your 5 EBT birthday en the cleaning girls THANKS

-flop- wrote:The almost general opinion in italian forum is not that all Pinco's note were good but that, for sure, some of the deleted ones were.

Yes, certainly. This is almost always the case -- some genuine entries may also get removed during the cleanup of fake entries. If some user doesn't like this policy, he can avoid this fate by simply not entering any fake notes. Pincopallino did enter fake notes, so he must accept the consequences and not just expect others to spend an enormous amount of time cleaning up his entries.

-flop- wrote:So nobody here is angry because Pincopallino has been hit by the cleaning group, but a lot of people agree to consider the applied method unusually radical.

No. In fact, this is very precisely the same method that we (I and Nerzhul) were using when we were still the only persons responsible for deleting fake notes. This is in no way an unusually cruel punishment for Pinco, this same methodology has been used for most fakers in the past. The only unusual part in this is the unusually large amount of notes affected. I believe we should treat everyone equally, regardless of the amount of notes entered.

I can certainly understand the shock for the Italian users, but .. seriously, you should get over this.

(not a spokesperson for the DB WG)