Topic in English

[spasiba]

You can see the timetables of all ship companies between Helsinki and Tallinn in http://www.viroweb.com/linkit/aikataulut.asp" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; . Unfortunately they are only in Finnish, but the information is quite clear anyway.
The weekdays MA-SU are Monday-Sunday.
"ei" means "not"
"asti" means "until".

Thank you! Finnish seems to be quite easy.

[Isc]

Thank you! Finnish seems to be quite easy.

Trust me, it's not!

[Dakkus]

Thank you! Finnish seems to be quite easy.

Trust me, it's not!

Well, it's not any easier than English, German, Chinese, Arabic or Hungarian. Not really any more difficult, either. Of course it requires a person to revamp their thinking of languages a bit when they learn a langage from a new language family, but that doesn't really mean the language itself would be any more complicated than some other language.

And the difference between the language families of course works both ways around. It is as difficult for a Finn to learn an Indo-European language such as Spanish, Russian or English as it is for a speaker of an Indo-European language to learn Finnish. And since almost everybody in Finland can speak English, I don't think the difference could be that very hard to overcome

[De-Ker]

You can see the timetables of all ship companies between Helsinki and Tallinn in http://www.viroweb.com/linkit/aikataulut.asp" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; . Unfortunately they are only in Finnish, but the information is quite clear anyway.
The weekdays MA-SU are Monday-Sunday.
"ei" means "not"
"asti" means "until".

Thank you! Finnish seems to be quite easy.

http://www.eckeroline.fi/en/default.aspx" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; is has often the cheapest offers. The boat trip (especially the way back) is an experience on its own (beware, drunken Fins). You can use euro's on the boat and near the harbour. Also a lot of exchange thingy's in the harbour. In other words, easy to get 'Estonian' notes.

[Isc]

Well, it's not any easier than English, German, Chinese, Arabic or Hungarian. Not really any more difficult, either. Of course it requires a person to revamp their thinking of languages a bit when they learn a langage from a new language family, but that doesn't really mean the language itself would be any more complicated than some other language.

I'm trying to teach a bit to my mexican friend and it made me realise how hard it can be. My brother in law for example gave up on it, he is born Brit and learned Spanish in a year or so. Finnish was too hard or he got too lazy. Anyway this is going bit off topic.

[Luumi]

Well, it's not any easier than English, German, Chinese, Arabic or Hungarian. Not really any more difficult, either. Of course it requires a person to revamp their thinking of languages a bit when they learn a langage from a new language family, but that doesn't really mean the language itself would be any more complicated than some other language.

I'm trying to teach a bit to my mexican friend and it made me realise how hard it can be. My brother in law for example gave up on it, he is born Brit and learned Spanish in a year or so. Finnish was too hard or he got too lazy. Anyway this is going bit off topic.

Offtopic or not, but my aunt's husband learned finnish very well in a few years, but he knew various European languages already and was originally from Serbia.

Anyhow, we in Finland understand very well if a foreigner can't speak a word in finnish even after several months of stay.

[Dakkus]

Well, it's not any easier than English, German, Chinese, Arabic or Hungarian. Not really any more difficult, either. Of course it requires a person to revamp their thinking of languages a bit when they learn a langage from a new language family, but that doesn't really mean the language itself would be any more complicated than some other language.

I'm trying to teach a bit to my mexican friend and it made me realise how hard it can be. My brother in law for example gave up on it, he is born Brit and learned Spanish in a year or so. Finnish was too hard or he got too lazy. Anyway this is going bit off topic.

Yup. Learning any language at all can be ridiculously difficult. The only exception from this rule are language from the same language group. And even then there are subgroups inside which languages are easier to learn than languages from other subgroups.
A German-speaker learns Spanish or Russian indeed a LOT easier than Finnish. That's because Spanish and Russian are both Indo-European languages and so in German. Finnish is not an Indo-European language, but a Finno-Ugric one instead.
German being an Indo-European language means it is essentially the same as Spanish, Russian or Greek - but does not have such similarities with Finnish.
For a German speaker Finnish is thus as easy as Chinese, Swahili or Cherokee.
For a Chinese speaker it is as difficult to learn German as it is to learn Finnish, Swahili or Cherokee. That's because the "difficulty" of the Finnish language for a German speaker doesn't come from the language being difficult per se, but from it being different.
Europeans are just ridiculously spoiled by the fact that practically all languages in Europe are related to each other (exceptions being Finnish, Estonian, Hungarian, Basque and Maltese)

For a Chinese speaker this is very different, because they don't speak anything similar to Chinese in most neighbouring countries:
Japanese (similar to Korean, not similar to Chinese)
Russian (similar to Hindi and French, not similar to Chinese)
Mongolian (similar to Turkish, not similar to Chinese)
Korean (similar to Japanese, not similar to Chinese)
Kazakh (similar to Turkish and Mongolian, not similar to Chinese)
Vietnamese (sorry, don't know..)
Hindi (similar to Russian and Latvian, not similar to Chinese)

As you can see, whereas a German-speaker has only Indo-European languages (his own language group) around him, a Chinese-speaker has people from several different language groups around him and none from his own language family. Europeans are just being spoiled by everyone around them speaking very similar languages. That doesn't mean the languages in Europe would be /easy/. They are just by most parts the same, so the speakers of those languages never have to bother digging as deep into the structures of language as people from outside Europe do.

For a Chinese-speaker Finnish is just as easy/difficult as English, German, Russian and Spanish are. Or Swahili or Cherokee, for that matter.

You would have precisely the same problems teaching English to a Chinese person that you have teaching Finnish to someone speaking German.
Bear in mind that people who already have managed to learn English, have also learned the concept of Indo-European languages. Therefore, anyone who you are able to communicate with in English is able to learn Spanish or Russian easier than he is able to learn Finnish. But that's not because of Finnish being difficult but because of the work he has already done with Indo-European languages because of having learnt English. A Chinese person who has never learned any foreign language will have the same problems with English as he will have with Finnish.

Keep in mind, Finnish language comes from Middle-Asia (nowadays known as "the bulk of Russia"), whereas the Indo-European languages all come from around eastern Turkey. There are several thousands of kilometres between those two areas and those several thousands of kilometres were very difficult to travel 10 000 year ago.

[De-Ker]

Well, it's not any easier than English, German, Chinese, Arabic or Hungarian. Not really any more difficult, either. Of course it requires a person to revamp their thinking of languages a bit when they learn a langage from a new language family, but that doesn't really mean the language itself would be any more complicated than some other language.

I'm trying to teach a bit to my mexican friend and it made me realise how hard it can be. My brother in law for example gave up on it, he is born Brit and learned Spanish in a year or so. Finnish was too hard or he got too lazy. Anyway this is going bit off topic.

Yup. Learning any language at all can be ridiculously difficult. The only exception from this rule are language from the same language group. And even then there are subgroups inside which languages are easier to learn than languages from other subgroups.
A German-speaker learns Spanish or Russian indeed a LOT easier than Finnish. That's because Spanish and Russian are both Indo-European languages and so in German. Finnish is not an Indo-European language, but a Finno-Ugric one instead.
German being an Indo-European language means it is essentially the same as Spanish, Russian or Greek - but does not have such similarities with Finnish.
For a German speaker Finnish is thus as easy as Chinese, Swahili or Cherokee.
For a Chinese speaker it is as difficult to learn German as it is to learn Finnish, Swahili or Cherokee. That's because the "difficulty" of the Finnish language for a German speaker doesn't come from the language being difficult per se, but from it being different.
Europeans are just ridiculously spoiled by the fact that practically all languages in Europe are related to each other (exceptions being Finnish, Estonian, Hungarian, Basque and Maltese)

For a Chinese speaker this is very different, because they don't speak anything similar to Chinese in most neighbouring countries:
Japanese (similar to Korean, not similar to Chinese)
Russian (similar to Hindi and French, not similar to Chinese)
Mongolian (similar to Turkish, not similar to Chinese)
Korean (similar to Japanese, not similar to Chinese)
Kazakh (similar to Turkish and Mongolian, not similar to Chinese)
Vietnamese (sorry, don't know..)
Hindi (similar to Russian and Latvian, not similar to Chinese)

As you can see, whereas a German-speaker has only Indo-European languages (his own language group) around him, a Chinese-speaker has people from several different language groups around him and none from his own language family. Europeans are just being spoiled by everyone around them speaking very similar languages. That doesn't mean the languages in Europe would be /easy/. They are just by most parts the same, so the speakers of those languages never have to bother digging as deep into the structures of language as people from outside Europe do.

For a Chinese-speaker Finnish is just as easy/difficult as English, German, Russian and Spanish are. Or Swahili or Cherokee, for that matter.

You would have precisely the same problems teaching English to a Chinese person that you have teaching Finnish to someone speaking German.
Bear in mind that people who already have managed to learn English, have also learned the concept of Indo-European languages. Therefore, anyone who you are able to communicate with in English is able to learn Spanish or Russian easier than he is able to learn Finnish. But that's not because of Finnish being difficult but because of the work he has already done with Indo-European languages because of having learnt English. A Chinese person who has never learned any foreign language will have the same problems with English as he will have with Finnish.

Keep in mind, Finnish language comes from Middle-Asia (nowadays known as "the bulk of Russia"), whereas the Indo-European languages all come from around eastern Turkey. There are several thousands of kilometres between those two areas and those several thousands of kilometres were very difficult to travel 10 000 year ago.

A lot of theory here, but it all boils down to the fact that i don't necessarily need Finnish here to get something, (where as that is definitely the case in Spain, china or japan). Just like Luumi mentioned.
Furthermore Finnish isn't very helpful in any other country except Finland. thus eliminating the trigger to learn an extra important language like spanish, chinese or japanese (of course japanese is only official in japan, but still quite important).

At least the writing system is completely the same here as is the pronouncation of most letters (for me only the consonant V is hard. The vowels a, e, ä are sometimes hard to distinguish as well, lastly the y is although completely different from the dutch or English y, but it sounds the same as the dutch U) .

However the difference between speaking and writing seems quite significant over here, Which makes it hard to grasp.
As for myself, i now start to understand some basic words and know what things mean in a supermarket.
I can say what my name is, some very basic meet and greet and some standard sentences. So be aware, i will soon be able to understand other topics within this finnish subforum

Hyvää yötä

ps. i don't try to assume i know any finnish her yet. still loads of probs understanding the different endings of words depending on their meaning within the sentence, the use of Ko in a question and the usage of 'to have'

[Dakkus]

Yup, what is written is essentially a different language to what is spoken.
In the news they speak written language, though, and there you can hear they are saying things precisely as they are written.
When you are writing spoken Finnish, you don't write "minä" but "mä" instead. Etc.

A word such as "to have" does not exist in Finnish at all, so you won't be able use it. Difficult using something that does not exist
If you want to say "I have", you have to say "with me is".

The perfect tense works just the same as in English, which means it works the opposite way around than in Dutch or German. This also applies to past tense: It works just like its English counterpart.

Also, the letter Ü is called "saksalainen yy" in Finnish. Maybe that'll hint what the y is supposed to mean. It would actually make more sense using the letter ü instead. I blame the Swedes for this evil

[bochius]

Thanks to emppu for sending this bill in the right direction.

[DBpbzfa766]

YEAH !!!

http://de.eurobilltracker.com/notes/?id=80215872

Thanks to "Curre"

to find my Bill in Finnland ^^

now i can go happy to the Work : )^^

[Crazy Bob]

Hi jami, congratulations on your first hit with Holland

[jami]

Thank you for finding my note!
Yes, that's my first hit in Netherlands
Merry Christmas

[an-148]

http://fr.eurobilltracker.com/notes/?id=79888161" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

thanks to JJJI


(I hope this bill will be spent in Finland )

[Asiamaniac]

Kiitos, Eliezer for my third inofficial intercontinental hit.