Rare Euro banknote

ye olde · Post by **ye olde** » Fri Dec 01, 2006 7:08 pm

Dakkus wrote:Hmm.. Telling the first five numbers should - in my understanding - not cause any security threat, as the rest five (plus one) of the numbers would still be obscured, resulting to tens of thousands of serial numbers to go through in order to get a hit with a serial number seen in the note listing.
They would also serve all the same functions the current scheme (Axxxx1234xxx) has.
In other words, changing the number showing system from Axxxx1234xxx to A12345xxxxxx would apparently not pose any kind of a threat of fake hits.
Right?

In order for anyone being able to do some sort of research, one needs to have six digits of the controlnumber.

Reason: Some countries use these six digits to define the sheet position. Example Portugal: 50 Euro (De la Rue printing H) uses both, five and six digits.

D1 is M91285xxxxx* as well as M913075xxxx*.

But as you fear security threats (something, I still do not go along with) you may forget the whole thing anyway.

How do you want to check the Dutch notes, where they use digits no. 5, 6 and 7 (J.Enschede G printig) to define the sheet position.Oops I forgot, for 100 and 200 Euro, they even use digits nos. 5, 6, 7 and 8 !!!!

As far as I can see, the best way is the way, Eurotracer shows the numbers, i.e. A12345678xx* .

On the other hand, someone who wants to cheat can easily define full sheets and lodge the numbers. Just in case, do you want a full range of numbers for Finnish F.C.Oberthur 5 Euro notes ? Easy as pie ! By the way, here you need the first six digits as well.

By the way, how does EBT check the correctness of given numbers ? How does EBT check the sheet position. Is a Greek 20 Euro Y00026016112 N001C4 or is it N001G5 ??

ICU
ye olde

androl · Post by **androl** » Fri Dec 01, 2006 9:06 pm

ye olde wrote:In order for anyone being able to do some sort of research, one needs to have six digits of the controlnumber.
Oops I forgot, for 100 and 200 Euro, they even use digits nos. 5, 6, 7 and 8 !!!!

most of the X notes also need 8 digits
And then, there are exceptions for notes that have Xxxxxxxxx00x, these have the same code as Xxxxxxxx(x-1)99x and not like Xxxxxxxxx01x
That could give cheaters the possibility to find such serials from ET

ye olde wrote:how does EBT check the correctness of given numbers ? How does EBT check the sheet position. Is a Greek 20 Euro Y00026016112 N001C4 or is it N001G5

I think the point of EBT is that it doesn't matter that much. It's just not the biggest point of interest to EBT. I heard though that there are some checks of some combinations, to find the biggest mistakes that cheaters could make. Perhaps N or U notes or such. I doubt that it's comparable to our researches.

ye olde · Post by **ye olde** » Fri Dec 01, 2006 10:32 pm

androl wrote: That could give cheaters the possibility to find such serials from ET

I must admit, I still have problems understanding this fear of cheaters. As far as I am concerned, anyone, who wants to cheat, can do it without too much problems.

I believe, I can give you immediately on the spot several odd-thousand numbers, which will all be correct, because I would just apply the logic of the numbering policies of the various countries. So if anyone wants to cheat - just use an Excel file and have the calculation of numbers done by the computer.

For this reason, you will always see my complete correct numbers when I talk about them. No abbreviations.

Angelino · Post by **Angelino** » Sat Dec 02, 2006 12:10 am

Do you have any

bill in this serial range?

V0664 to V0667

They have a very strange plate number M001. I have 6 notes ot them.

....- V0663 M006xx
V0664-V0667 M001xx
V0668-... M007xx

ye olde · Post by **ye olde** » Sat Dec 02, 2006 6:45 pm

Angelino wrote:Do you have any bill in this serial range?

V0664 to V0667

They have a very strange plate number M001. I have 6 notes ot them.

....- V0663 M006xx
V0664-V0667 M001xx
V0668-... M007xx

It looks, as if the Spanish use 50 Euro M001 sporadically over the range. They also use the first five digits to define the sheet position and they go from A5...A1; B5....B1;.... H5...H1.

As you can see, M001 is used in charges 1 - 20, share charge 21 with M002 (but no clear cut in the numbering), is used again in charges 61 to 64 (the latter again being shared with M002 and no clear cut), used again in charge 88 (together with M002 and M003, no clear cut) and solitarily in charge 143 as well as 167, the range you have asked for.

Code: Select all

Druck	von 	bis	charge von - bis		
M001	00000	00799	1	20	
M001/
M002	00800	00839	21		keine Differenzierung festzustellen
M002	00840	01799	22	45	
M003	01800	02319	46	58	
M002	02320	02399	59	60	
M001	02400	02519	61	63	
M001/
M002	02520	02559	64		keine Differenzierung festzustellen
M002	02560	02599	65		
M003	02600	02639	66 a		bis Vxxxxx69999x
M002	02600	02639	66 b		ab  Vxxxxx70000x
M003	02640	03319	67	83	
M004	03320	03479	84	87	
M001/
M003/
M004	03480	03519	88		keine Differenzierung festzustellen
M004	03520	04359	89	109	
M005	04360	05439	110	136	
M006	05440	05679	137	142	
M001	05680	05719	143		
M006	05720	06639	144	166	
M001	06640	06679	167		
M007	06680	07559	168	189

As far as my 'Katalog V Spanien' is concerned, I am still working on it - it is very time consuming, but I hope to have it finished before the Year's end. There you may find all the individual breakdowns in the printing codes

for all values, including the 10 Euro G

Elmo · Post by **Elmo** » Sun Dec 03, 2006 12:57 am

Today I stumbled across an Irish €20 bill with H004 as shortcode. The
serial number starts with T322950. I have researched my database for more
of these bills, and it appears I have only one other bill like this, with a serial
number starting with T322801. Another curious thing is that I have an H003/
T322864/€20 bill as well.

Do more people have any Irish H004 €20 bills? And how many of these bills
does the EBT database contain?

P.S. There is no need to come up with Portuguese H004 €20 bills, because these are very common.

Phaseolus · Post by **Phaseolus** » Sun Dec 03, 2006 10:14 am

I have none of these.

Sneakster · Post by **Sneakster** » Sun Dec 03, 2006 10:37 am

I got one, T322965xxxxx H004xx
This, however, is the only one out of 33 Irish €20 notes.

androl · Post by **androl** » Sun Dec 03, 2006 11:11 am

that's all right.

T315550-T322749 is H003
T322975-T323109 is H004

between T322750 and T322974 it is
H003 with 6th digit 9,8,7,4,3,2
H004 with 6th digit 6,5,1,0

and the same thing happens between T315325 and T315549 with the 6th digit:
9,8,4,3 is H002
7,6,5,2,1,0 is H003

Fons · Post by **Fons** » Sun Dec 03, 2006 2:36 pm

I have got 0 of them

Licht & Feuer · Post by **Licht & Feuer** » Sun Dec 03, 2006 2:42 pm

ye olde wrote:
androl wrote:That could give cheaters the possibility to find such serials from ET
I must admit, I still have problems understanding this fear of cheaters. As far as I am concerned, anyone, who wants to cheat, can do it without too much problems.

Hi ye olde!

Thanks alot for your response on my problem with the "spanish "plate-break", I'm currently not at home but I'll send you the full numbers by PM.

As EBT is mainly about watching where the notes go, the cheater-problem is indeed serious because if someone enters reconstructed numbers, the note is linked to a place where it most probably never has been.
It's a pity that a few people do not realise that a fantasy-line on a virtual map don`t give you a hit but feeds the database with crap.

Smike · Post by **Smike** » Sun Dec 03, 2006 6:22 pm

androl wrote:P0000-P0064 ==> G001
P0065-P0069 ==> G006
// unknown zone
P0100-P0307 ==> P001
// unknown zone
P0315-P0709 ==> G006
P0710-P0741 ==> G007
P0747-P0747 ==> G008
P0754-P0781 ==> G009
P0785-P0786 ==> G006
P0792-P0792 ==> G009
P0801-P1015 ==> G010 Trichet
P1016-P1016 ==> G011 Trichet
P1022-P1082 ==> G010 Trichet

Today I received a G007 P0791

euro note.

I was quite surprised and since I didn't find it on your list yet, I guess it is a pretty rare note (well, at least to date).

ye olde · Post by **ye olde** » Mon Dec 04, 2006 7:13 pm

Smike wrote:Today I received a G007 P0791 euro note.

I was quite surprised and since I didn't find it on your list yet, I guess it is a pretty rare note (well, at least to date).

Pretty, in case it's UNC, certainly - but rare ? 540.000 banknotes exist of G007 P0791 - but the same applies to G007 P0711 or G007 P0721 and to all other G007 notes.

If you really want to have a slightly rare note from Holland, G008 would be a better bet - up to now this code consists of 540.000 notes in total (from what we know today) only.

Or are you the Million $ man, who can collect not only printing codes but numbers as well ?

Smike · Post by **Smike** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 1:11 pm

ye olde wrote:
Smike wrote:Today I received a G007 P0791 euro note.

I was quite surprised and since I didn't find it on your list yet, I guess it is a pretty rare note (well, at least to date).
Pretty, in case it's UNC, certainly - but rare ? 540.000 banknotes exist of G007 P0791 - but the same applies to G007 P0711 or G007 P0721 and to all other G007 notes.

If you really want to have a slightly rare note from Holland, G008 would be a better bet - up to now this code consists of 540.000 notes in total (from what we know today) only.

Or are you the Million $ man, who can collect not only printing codes but numbers as well ?

As far as I knew, G007

went from P071 to P074 as was listed in the list androl posted. All P079 notes (which are already rare) had G009 as shortcode. Looking at some NIG statistics of big dutch users learned me they also didn't have the G007 P079 combination, so to me they seem very rare. (Although I did see them having a G006 P079 combination, so I was just curious if there was some kind of updated list of the dutch

possible combinations).

ye olde · Post by **ye olde** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 7:18 pm

Smike wrote:As far as I knew, G007 went from P071 to P074 as was listed in the list androl posted. All P079 notes (which are already rare) had G009 as shortcode. Looking at some NIG statistics of big dutch users learned me they also didn't have the G007 P079 combination, so to me they seem very rare. (Although I did see them having a G006 P079 combination, so I was just curious if there was some kind of updated list of the dutch possible combinations).

Please do not think I want to anger you - certainly your note is rare, but the fact is, you just look at three digits of the controlnumber, whereas you should consider the first four digits.

As you know, the 10 Euro Dutch controlnumbers are made up like this:

P1111xxxxxx* (the first four digits define the printing range, i.e. G007), digit nos. 5 and 6 define the sheet position of the note (Pxxxx11xxxx* as example, which by the way stands for E5) - and nos. 7, 8, 9 and 10 are the real sheet numbers, which means each P1111 for example has a total of 10.000 sheets printed - and as each sheet has 54 notes (9x6), thus 540.000 notes are printed for each four digit code.

Now to your comment

All P079 notes (which are already rare) had G009 as shortcode.

1)androl mentions P0792, not P079 - and you have just found a G007 P079, oops P0791 ! But G009 has the range P0754 - P0781 as well, which means, 29x10.000 sheets do exist in G009. I still believe, if you really want a rare 10 Euro note from your home country, take the G008 - and enjoy having G007 P0791 as well. I would like to have them both as well as any other UNC dutch banknote !

2) and just in case your comment is valid, what about P074 ?

ICU
ye olde