When do you know a language?

[turtle]

Since there is always that question how many languages do you know/do you speak, i was wondering when you speak/know a language...
Do you say you know a language
- when you've learned a language for some years
- when you can have plain talk in that language
- when you can have more then plain talk in that language
- when you know the language perfectly (like when it's your mother tongue?)

I would not say when you've learned a language for some years, because that says nothing..I've learned French for 5 years, but my Spanish that I've learned for 2 years is just as good.
And how about languages you can only read? Like I've had Latin on school for 5 years, I can read it with a dictionary, but isn't that with all languages? Although i think the difference is that from Latin i know the structure, from all those other languages not..
And also a question: if you already learned to read Ancient-Greek and you're learning now New-Greek as well reading as speaking, is it then a new language, or just a continuation of the Ancient-Greek
And for example if you are Dutch, you can understand South-African or even Swedish, don't you think it's stupid to say when people ask for your languages that you can understand South-African? I think it is...
So where is the border between knowing a language and not?
Here end my language philosophy questions

[doiknow]

OK here it goes my understanding of knowing/speaking al language:

You know a language
-rudimentary: if you could buy something in supermarket, ask for toilet and order fodd in a restaurant - but you prefer to use english...
-partly if you know conjugation of verbs, decliation of nouns and up to some hundred words. You are just like an immigrant...
-good/well if u don't need any dictionary to get along.
-excellent if the persons you are talking to do not believe you are a stranger.
-perfectly if u know familary language and you can use it. Just like: 'ur 2 fast 4 me'
-mother tongue - nothing to explain here?

[lazza]

I also think that there is the question of whether you think in that language - I would say that this is a good sign of being fluent in a language (in other words, you don't need to think of what you want to say in your mother tongue, then mentally translate it - you just say it in the other language straight out)

[Titania_eu]

You know that you know a language when you immediately start thinking in that language when, for example, you are visiting that particular country and when you dream in that language now and then.

[Dakkus]

I have a very loose definition for knowing a language:

When I can speak so that people who have never learned any language other than that one understand me, I can speak the language.

If I can also understand the answer, then I know the language.

Currently I say that I know six and a half languages, the half one being Russian, in which I can get most things done, but in which I always have to ask the answer to be yes or no

I claim to be relatively good with Estonian, although I sometimes have problems understanding some Estonian words. (But in any case, I managed to get an Estonian to become a monthly donator for Unicef because of knowing Estonian. And she said that ma eesti keelt väga hästi räägin )

[diogocanilho]

I claim to be relatively good with Estonian, although I sometimes have problems understanding some Estonian words. (But in any case, I managed to get an Estonian to become a monthly donator for Unicef because of knowing Estonian. And she said that ma eesti keelt väga hästi räägin )

EBT don't have (yet) the estonian translation. Maybe you can use your skills there!

I have the same oppinion as Dakkus. You know that you know a language when you can be understood by others who really know that language...

[turtle]

I claim to be relatively good with Estonian, although I sometimes have problems understanding some Estonian words. (But in any case, I managed to get an Estonian to become a monthly donator for Unicef because of knowing Estonian. And she said that ma eesti keelt väga hästi räägin )

EBT don't have (yet) the estonian translation. Maybe you can use your skills there!

I have the same oppinion as Dakkus. You know that you know a language when you can be understood by others who really know that language...

And when you have a conversation of more then 5 lines I think you should add..because for example when i was in greece, i talked greek everytime when i could, just words like "good evening, hello, thanks, this one" etc, tourist-greek...but then sometimes greek people talked greek back to me, and then i didn't understand it at all anymore.. But I guess they've understand me very well then if they talk in greek back to me (or they just don't speak english and say "I don't understand" in Greek )

So I think Dakkus is quite right with saying that you should also be able to understand the answer.

And what was said about that you know a language perfectly when you know familary language, i don't think that's true...For example I know familary language in German, English, Spanish and Finnish.. (and Dutch ofcourse) But this doesn't say anything about the rest of my level, because Finnish I didn't learn on a school, i learned it by writing, so i already got the familary language very early. And Spanish i do get on school for two years, but I got a lot of slang to know because i got to know some spanish people of my age who use a lot of slang, by a exchange!


But what I've heard till now are almost only about the living languages...What about the dead languages, Latin and Ancient-Greek, can you just add them to your languages or shouldn't you?
For example, for Latin we have only grammar now (although the first three year also many words), but I've had it already for 5 years, so it wouldn't be quite fair to dont mention it.
But for Ancient-Greek, which I've had for 3 years, and don't have anymore, it was the same, first words, then mostly grammar. But actually I don't remember many of it anymore...And I think it will go the same with Latin, just because you don't use it in your modern life anymore...

Wait, I'll stop here, otherwise this post will be too long to be true